Moving On From Dempster
July 25, 2012 at 10:51 am by Franklin Rabon under Atlanta Braves
After all the craziness from yesterday, it appears that most everything that was reported here was 100% accurate. The Braves have moved on from Dempster, and while they’d still field calls from the Cubs, it’s a low priority, highly unlikely, and the deal the Braves would offer the Cubs wouldn’t be the same.
As was stated last night, the Braves had top scout Jim Fregosi watching Greinke, who gave quite a show. He seems to have answered any health questions that may have been out there in the aftermath of his skipped start. The Brewers still seem to be holding out for an astronomical, in fact comical, haul for him, but there is some belief that they are slowly softening. Obviously Greinke is the top target in the sense that he is the guy the Braves most want, but they certainly don’t seem willing to give up Teheran and Delgado for him, which still seems to be what the Brewers want.
I know the Braves are looking at other pitchers as well, but I don’t really have any information about them, other than simply reading MLBTR just like the rest of you.
It is not believed that the Braves are particularly close to a deal with another club at the moment, but occasionally these things can be quick in developing. And ‘security’ has seemingly tightened up a bit in the aftermath of all this. All I know as of now is that the Braves are targeting several pitchers, that they are actively talking to a number of different teams, and that Greinke is still atop their wish list.
It is not believed that being division rivals would be a major impediment in a potential Josh Johnson trade, should the Braves pursue that route. Though I have no idea where he ranks in their priority list.
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I would take Greinke if we didn’t have to give up Teheran AND Delgado. Otherwise, I don’t want him for what it would take to get him.
Agreed. Just to throw this out there, pertaining to the trade deadline but not specifically pitching, what would some of you think about trading Juan Francisco to the Yankees for Andruw Jones? They need a 3B power bat and we need bench depth in the outfield. Hinske and Diaz ain’t cutting it, and Andruw has had a pretty good season and is pretty cheap. He wouldn’t even need to fight for his old number 25!
Juan could wear out the short porch in right at Yankee Stadium too. Just saying. I’d like to Andruw back, even if it’s only for a little while.
*get Andruw back
Ha!! This site is a much better place to get accurate information than from a homer like Dave O’Brien. You would think that he is paid by the Braves, not the AJC.
I’m also not surprised that security has tightened up in the last 24 hours. The Braves generally don’t like this kind of news leaking out to the public.
I hope the Braves do get Greinke but I don’t want them to give up Delgado AND Teheran. The deal should be centered around Teheran and a couple of other players further away from being major league ready (Gilmartin, Bethancourt, Spruill, etc.).
If Johnson can be had for Teheran plus another prospect, I’d go with that. My wish list for this month: Josh Johnson, Ryan Kalish (much better LH bat off the bench than Hinske and can start in our OF next year), Reed Johnson, and Wade Davis. Diaz and Hinske are not a playoff type of bench. Kalish is stuck in AAA due to Boston’s numerous outfield options.
I have never thought of Kalish but yes he would be a decent option. An option they may consider in the offseason if they do not re-sign Bourn is Bourjos(unless as it has been reported he is traded to the Rays).
They’re telling inquiring teams that Josh Johnson’s finger injury is not an issue, and if he’s ready to pitch consistently like he did a couple nights ago, I’d take him over just about anybody else we could realistically get. I like Shields, but he gives up a lot of hits, and I like Greinke, but he will cost way too much in prospects and an extension. The Phillies screwed us on Greinke when they extended Hamels for 6 yrs and 144 million bucks. Now Greinke’s agent is licking his chops.
I haven’t had time to look at the advanced metrics on Liriano, but as a Twins fan (alongside my lifelong love for the Braves) and someone who has seen every game he’s ever pitched in his career, I’d rather take a chance with Mike Hampton at this point than Frankie Freakout.
One bad at-bad and Liriano completely melts down. I’m not sold on the 25 strikeouts in the recent two starts, he’s just another manifestation of JJ.
Keep the trade chips or use them on a bona fide starter, but don’t give up anyone of note for Frankie; it’s simply not worth it.
Franklin, you know as much as the rest of us, that the the original reporting you have done on this was all based on their reports. They are just looking for a scapegoat. Fuck them.
Do you know if Garza (Don’t think anyone has picked him up) is on that list still? Or has the entire Dempster debacle made the Braves leery of dealing with the Cubs whatsoever? If so, Garza should be pissed.
The Johnson deal would make a good bit of sense for us in that the Marlins are obviously selling practically everything at this point. We could likely pick up a bench bat along with Johnson and still not have to give up a ton. I think it was rumored that the Dodgers weren’t even going to have to give up Lee to get him. I would assume that means that if we did give up Delgado, we could get a two-fer?
Garza is still available. The Braves may be more willing to discuss Garza over Dempster too given with Garza they do not need to work around trade vetoes.
Sorry, but there’s no way that’s accurate. A rumor this morning said that Texas was willing to give up Mike Olt for Johnson. His upside and team-control should make him more available than Greinke. Delgado by himself would not be enough for Johnson, much less for Johnson plus something else.
My apologies… I had combined two stories into one. The Dodgers did not have to give up Lee for Hanley and were not going to offer him up for Dempster. Basically, that reserves him for use to get Johnson.
Meant to say “more expensive” not “more available” in reference to Josh Johnson.
Is it just me or is the price for James Shields relatively low. The Angels are offering Bourjos, Conger, and Ervin Santana. I feel like he would be a good chip as well for Atlanta and he does not have an expiring contract this year. TB is looking for a catcher and while it seems a little risky what about a deal centered around Delgado and Bethancourt. Maybe include Lipka and Spurill?
I wouldn’t mind getting Shields either but I wouldn’t give up Delgado for him.
were you fine with delgado in the dempster deal? considering their underlying stats, age, and league competition, i’d rather have shields.
Also I believe Shields has 2 more years on his contract. They are both club options with $1M buyouts. They seem pretty affordable too.
Absolutely not!! I was thrilled when the Dempster deal fell apart.
And, yes, I would prefer Shields to Dempster.
From the reports that I’ve read, the Rays are looking for everyday players, not pitchers, in a deal for Shields, which would leave the Braves out of the picture.
(a) I’m pretty sure that Bourjos is more valuable than Delgado (or at least should be) and (b) I think that when teams are “looking for” help at a certain position it means help that is either ready now or will be next season – Bethancourt needs a lot more time in the minors before teams will start looking at him to fill a need rather than simply add talent to the farm system.
No way I’d give away that much for Shields. Yeah, he might be a good fit here, but if it came to dealing Spruill, Bethancourt, etc. I’d just as well keep Delgado in the rotation instead of JJ and cut my losses. Hopefully Minor has turned a corner, and I still have no clue how long Sheets can keep this up, but I see no need to trade away a good portion of our young talent to get a middle of rotation guy.
Actually, I’m glad a deal for Dempster did not go through. I know he is pitching very well this season – but based on his career, I’d say this year has been an anomaly, and I’m not sure if we could have expected the same stats from him if he were in a Braves uniform.
Anyway, let’s see who the Braves decide to target next.
His numbers indicate has has been better on the road. While his career ERA FIP and xFIP are not great they have greatly improved since becoming a starter in Chicago other than 2 years ago. Other than that they have been pretty solid. He has also pretty regularly outpitched his FIP and xFIP in that frame. However, given the whole issue with Dempster I am happy it fell through.
Haha true, but someone posted yesterday that his record at Turner field is 0-8 with some insanely high ERA. Of course, he would no longer be pitching against the Braves at Turner, but it seems like the field is in his head for some reason.
Ack! There’s two of us!
I’ll change!
I’m pretty sure he has been on the DL twice already this year! I would hate for us to trade for him and have him miss any starts in the final two months.
Bowman is a chump – what a hack. Keep the great work up on this, much more informative than the two beat guys just rushing to get it out there first.
Bowman wasn’t the problem…
I love Bowman. Stand up guy all around. I just happened to get a series of good information, it was mostly luck on my part. Bowman never said anything implying that we were spreading misinformation. He was probably leery of relying on information we were giving out, which I 100% understand.
I’m just curious to see how all of this turns out now.
If we end up with Greinke, and the Dempster gets stuck in Chicago, we will laugh merrily at our good fortune (and maybe point a mocking finger in the general direction of Chicago).
If we end up with JJ still in the rotation (JJ being Jair not Josh), or some second rate starter who cost too much in prospects, and the Dempster gets to go to LA, then the wailing and gnashing of teeth will be heard all the way to the west coast.
I would certainly hope that in the unlikely event of the team not acquiring a starting pitcher, Delgado would replace Jurrjens.
agree 100%. I was just giving a worst case versus best case scenario for August 1.
It seems Minor and Delgado are both giving indications that they are turning a corner, but I guess a few more starts will be needed to see if the consistency from start to start is there. In either case, I trust both of them with the ball much more than Jair.
‘Sup, CAC. It’s your main man Stone Cold David O’Brien. I’m pretty steamed that you’re spreadin’ all this misinformation ’bout the Dempster trade situaish. I had a guy to guy with Frank Wren this mornin’, and he told me they hadn’t ruled out bringin’ Dempster to the ATL. Maybe you should stick to bloggin’ ’bout OPSBIs and leave the real reportin’ to me. Check the sabermetrics column for the latest news on Dempster, Hanson’s ERA since the All-Star break, and which indie tunes I’ve got in my Walkman.
How’s Ken?
gotta run, motorcycle date with fredi
I have been out of the loop the past few days but like most of you, I’m extremely glad that we are not making the trade for Dempster. Hopefully we can make a deal for Greinke sometime soon.
A GOD SEND! Jair Jurrjens is having his start skipped.
“The Cubs now plan to keep Dempster and make him a qualifying offer after the season, ESPN.com’s Buster Olney tweets. Doing so would allow the Cubs to collect a compensatory draft pick in 2013.”
Well right now that is half of the best equation Atlanta could have hoped for. Now they are going to have to get another SP
From MLBTR…
“The possibility of a trade exists, but the Cubs are frustrated by their lack of leverage, Morosi tweets.”
And to think they had all the leverage just 2 days ago.
It looks like the way the Cubs might get the leverage back is to keep him and make him a qualifying offer in the offseason.
They should feel pretty confident he will not accept the offer, then they can a least get a solid comp pick instead of the trash pickup that they can expect now from the Dodgers, who know there is no other team in the running.
Cubs will not receive a comp pick
Yeah they will. That’s what the qualifying offer is for.
John Schuerholz always had a way of completing a trade that seemed to come out of nowhere. I do realize that his administration operated in the days before social media, but I wish Wren and his people would operate as discreetly. It seems like the rumor mill really hurt this deal.
Pretty sure Michael Bourn came out of nowhere, keep the faith.
So did McLouth iirc (though I try to forget McLouth everyday
From what it seems, the rumor mill ultimately had nothing to do with it. Dempster thought he could commandeer a trade to the dodgers. The dodgers didn’t want dempster. the braves had to move on. That seems to be the beginning and the end of it.
The only thing about this I don’t understand is why Dempster ever gave the impression he would go to Atlanta. It makes him and the Cubs FO look stupid. If you only want to leave to go to LA, just tell your FO that. They probably won’t want that to be public info, but at least they’re not chasing deals that can’t happen and you don’t end up in a situation like this.
Well, I think he said he would prefer to go to LA unless such a deal was impossible. So if the Dodgers were totally unwilling to take him, he would have gone to the Braves. But what he is doing is basically saying the Cubs have to take anything the Dodgers offer or I’m staying put.
This whole Dempster situation is just hilarious. If what Buster Olney is true (The Cubs now plan to keep Dempster and make him a qualifying offer after the season) then teh Dumpster completely hosed the Cubs. He backs away from going to Atlanta, then the LAD probably reduced their offer for a petulence discount, now the Cubs are stuck with him (b/c no one else is going to overpay for a 36 year old having a career year who projects to do worse in the 2nd half) and must hope for the best after next year in which he will regress from this year. So Dempster alienates himself from his current team by blocking them from acquiring a potential 2 and solid future 3, alienates himself from the fans of the potential trade partner, and the only other team that wants him won’t pay what Dempster obviously thinks he’s worth. Nice little trifecta there if in fact he gets stuck with the Cubs. Good on ya, Dump.
Well, it’s not a petulence discount. They now know that they’re the only team in the bidding, so they’re not bidding against anyone else. They just have to find the Cubs’ minimum price.
Apparently, the Cubs have never liked what LA was offering, though, which is why this whole Braves situation occurred.
Call me crazy, but I’d take a flier on Francisco Liriano. I know he has played Jekyl and Hyde during his tenure with the Twins, but I feel like he could be a cheap target that would benefit with a change in venue. His stats suggest that he has not benefited from pitching in Minnesota as his FIP and xFIP have been lower than his ERA even in his better seasons. There was also talk that at one point the Twins asked him to change his pitching style and pitch more to contact. I think if Frank Wren could wheel and deal something similar to what the Braves gave up for Mike Bourn last year (ie mid-level prospect, god-willing throw in JJ, no-Teheran or Delgado), I think it gives the rotation at least a sured up look with a guy who will miss bats and eat innings.
Like I wrote above, and this is purely from watching every one of Frankie’s starts and not checking the metrics yet, it’s simply not worth it. You can count on him melting down more than him going six innings. He’s a head case and just another form of JJ.
I really hope the Braves don’t go after Liriano.
I just don’t see how he’s a worthwhile upgrade over Delgado or Minor or Sheets, or Hanson. We have plenty of starters who can be good, but unfortunately have not been consistently good.
What we need is a consistent ace or near ace to solidify the top end of the rotation. Anything less, then we might as well move on to the bench and pen as upgrades there would mean more than a Liriano-type to the rotation.
But he is hardly the “top-of-the rotation” pitcher that Wren says he wants. I would rather have Dempster, who at least is a known quantity, than Liriano, where you don’t know what you are getting. Just because he would be cheaper doesn’t mean he makes sense. The Braves need someone they can rely on for at least some improvement. If they can’t do better than Liriano, they might as well go with what they have because one game good, one game bad isn’t any better than what the Braves have now.
I can’t possibly believe they will let Johnson go as well, I would imagine Reyes and Johnson are the 2 not up for offers, however I would love it if they do let him go. Fuck the cubs and Dumpster, leave them to rot.
“The possibility of a trade exists, but the Cubs are frustrated by their lack of leverage, Morosi tweets. Chicago still hopes Dempster changes his mind about Atlanta, tweets Olney.”
Ha! I’m pretty sure we wouldn’t give a shit if he did at this point. Even if we were to listen, I’m not sure the Cubs would want the deal we’d offer.
Sorry Dempster, but you screwed yourself and the Cubs.
How did Dempster screw himself? He can wait till the offseason and go where he wants. It’s the Cubs he screwed.
Um… by basically condemning himself to remain playing for a sub-par team during a season in which he is having a monster year. Everyone knows he’s not capable of repeating these numbers, especially at his age. So, even being that “he can go anywhere he wants” after the season, somebody has to want him for that to happen. Obviously somebody will, but it’s going to be at a price that would have been less if he had just made a move now to a contender.
*would be less than*
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Shouldn’t the Braves prefer to have Johnson than Dempster? Am I missing something? The only reason I thought it was weird they weren’t talking to the Marlins about Johnson was because of the div. rival thing, but I guess that’s not an issue.
I meant – the reason I didn’t think it was weird was because of the div rival thing.
well, he’d likely cost a lot more than Dempster would have. That’s the biggest issue.
I guess it’s just speculation, but hey that’s fun too. Any idea what they’d want for Johnson – are we talking Teheran plus Delgado/Minor or just Teheran?
no idea. I’d guess either Teheran by himself or Delgado plus a few other of our better prospects.
Teheran’s 2012 numbers are scary. I’d be willing to move him for Johnson, especially since he’s not a two month rental. However, if Texas is offering up Olt, I would think the Marlins have to be more confident in his future than Teheran. With Miami trading Hanley, they have an opening at 3B that Olt would fill nicely.
So then what’s the harm in offering up Delgado for Johnson and seeing if the Fins bite? Throw Terdo in there to sweeten it up and call it a day.
Would that be considered an insult? I like that trade a whole lot more than trading for Dempster.
Nats are winning again. Damn it!
Nats are winning as the Mets appear to be spontaneously combusting which was always going to happen, they over performed to the all star break. Nats are for real and we will be hard pressed to catch them.
Does anyone think the Braves could trade Delgado, Teheran, and another lower level prospect for King Felix?
According to the Mariners GM, you couldn’t trade Felix for Felix.
According to the Mariner’s GM you couldn’t trade 2 Felix’s for Felix. Lol
Seems like all this will be a moot point if Hanson can’t figure out how to throw a ball over the plate. 65 pitches is 2 2/3 innings isn’t going to make us a contender. He’s got to figure it out or we’ll have two rotation spots to fill.
Hanson is going to get shut down for shoulder surgery by the end of the season. Bank on it.
That would sure explain the focus on getting another starter.
From a personal view, I would class Johnson and Greinke as being several classes above Dempster, Garza and all others up for the taking. Either Wren would have to have something good to blackmail the fish with ( maybe they feel sorry for giving us Frediot ) or we will be giving up plenty to snare one of these guys. Johnson would get me buzzing if we could get him, guess I will keep dreaming!
Wren is as discreet as you can possibly be as a GM. Most of his trades come out of nowhere and end up being much better for us than anyone would have thought (JJ trade, Uggla, Bourn, etc). I think he does a great job. It’s also not Bowman’s fault. He does a good job and is a stand up guy as Franklin said (he sent me a xmas email once). It’s the wild pack of turds over at espn, heyman, etc who report every whisper they hear. And then Dempster who thought he was slick trying to commandeer the trade.
Any big deal involving more than one of our big pitching prospects will most likely be Scheurholz whipping his dick out to give chipper a nicer swan song as he did for himself with acquiring Tex. if we get Greinke-who explicitly stated he will test the open market-this team will suck for a long time because of it.
The issue I have with Johnson is that the Marlins are a division rival. It would likely be nice to have Johnson for the next year and a half, but then he will walk and we will have to play the pieces we traded for him. I just don’t like the what-if of Delgado and/or Teheran in a rotation in our division.
The only thing that could have made the Texieira deal worse was if it was in our division.
Seriously, how many more Tommy walks >>> steals are we gonna see in this game? Ugh.
Is it just me or does this staff walk more batters than any other staff in the majors?
It’s just you. ATL staff is middle of the pack in both BBs and K/BB %.
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7th worst in the NL.
On a strange coincidental note, the Fish have stolen 7 bases off of Hanson/McCann today. It’s incredible how he’s only give up 1 run thus far.
Edit that to just Hanson. I’d like to think that McCann should have thrown out at least one guy, but historically Tommy has been easy to steal on. He rarely throws over and doesn’t slide step. Pair that with his wacky mechanics and he is just too slow getting it to the plate. Props to the Marlins for actually noticing and taking advantage of it. Well, given that they’ve only scored once, I guess they’re not really taking advantage of it.
McCann did get one trying for 3rd… he has no shot at 2nd with Hanson on the mound.
7 BB and 7 SB against Hanson in 5 innings with 108 pitches (52 balls). He got lucky that they have been dumping payroll and Stanton is on DL or he would have been crushed. It seems he has been slipping lately instead of settling in for the late season push. Makes me wonder how his shoulder is holding up.
Well at least when Juan does hit it there is no doubt its leaving the park. A sweet sight and Tommys going to get lucky – again!
How the hell can Hanson time and again with such terrible lack of control!? 100 pitches seriously!?! And not even through 4 innings. Hanson worries the hell out of me…
**Correction…not through 5 innings completed…
Somebody tell Chip it’s pronounced “CoNstanza,” not “Costanza” like the Seinfeld character.
I know this whole ordeal is to procure a front line starter, but at this point it might make sense to try out Medlen in the rotation and go after a reliever or two. Medlen has been excellent lately and beyond the Greinkes an Johnsons, there really aren’t many options that would be better than Kris. And obviously relievers and bench bats cost much less.
I also know this scenario wouldn’t happen, since that ship seems to have sailed.
LOL was just gonna say, just like you said to someone else, the Pence deal isn’t going to happen… The Medlen to the rotation idea isn’t going to happen. :)
Hanson has 7 walks, the Marlins have one run. They may be more garbage than the Mets now
Can we trade Chip for Johnson?
Tom the correspondant: “The kids here all sound and smell fantastic!”
huh?
Two random thoughts inspired by this game:
(1) Juan Francisco seems so much more effective as a starter than a pinch-hitter. Is his poor discipline a rational explanation for this observation? I recall a Fangraphs article suggesting that Vernon Wells poor discipline would make him even less effective in a pinch-hitting role. If the team decides to make Prado the long-term solution at 3B, it probably makes sense to trade Francisco, either at the deadline (to net a more effective bench bat and/or pitcher) or this off-season.
(2) Kris Medlen is so much more effective when he comes in with nobody on base. DOB mentioned his poor record at holding runners a few weeks ago. Is this a SSS oddity or are there any rational explanations?
I personally can’t answer those questions, but SSS seems to be the scapegoat for practically everything anymore.
As far as Francisco goes, SSS possibly, but yes he is much more effective as a starter.
In his career:
Starting 3B (229 AB): .279/.308/.472/.780 with 9 HR
PH (68 AB): .191/.286/.353/.639 3 HR
Interesting note, he has as many walks as a PH as he does as a starter. I guess he’s more inclined to watch a few pitches when coming off the bench. But yeah not to be all Joe Simpson, every game he starts he seems to have a big hit.
Being better as a starter than as a ph might be a general pattern not just a Francisco thing.
True
Might have to do with the typical pinch-hitter mentality. You’re coming in cold off the bench and usually in a situation that is pivotal to the game. Maybe he is just trying to do to much and swinging to hard. But, when he starts, he’s more relaxed on his swings?
Um, Kris Medlen just threw 3 (great) innings on 46 pitches in a game in which our mop up guys could’ve easily thrown an inning each. I’d say we’re stretching him out as a starter just in case we strike out on the trade front. Part of the same plan would be DFA’ing JJ and bringing up Gearrin or someone else I’d imagine.
Fredi pretty much said so too in his postgame comments. In other words, JJ has started his last game for the Atlanta Braves. Hoooorah!!!!
I understand its great having a security blanket in the pen, but enough is enough…put Medlen in the dgfg@e@#$-ing rotation.
How about a trade involving tommy hanson for greinke? hanson is still young and would be MLB talent who probably needs a fresh start, packaged with a few prospects like bethancourt and maybe matt lipka?
Gearrin has been really good at Triple-A. http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=518715
I would love to see Medlen moved into the rotation. Medlen was turning into an above average starter for the Braves in 2010 and I loved watching him pitch. At this point, the only way to get a starting pitcher is to overpay. Jurrjens should be DFA’d, Medlen should be moved into the rotation, a trade should be made for another guy out of the bullpen, Gearrin should replace Avilan in the bullpen, and then we just need to get a bench bat. If we make these moves, we should easily make the playoffs.
The word “should” was used a lot. I know.
Gearrin deserves a call up for bullpen help and Mejia should be called up as a bench bat. We could make the playoffs with a rotation of Hudson, Sheets, Hanson, Minor, Delgado or Medlen. We could use Teheran with Medlen or Delgado to the bullpen. Remember the Rays with Price a few years ago. That might help relax Teheran and he could dominate for 1 inning like Vizcaino last year. And I still think we should try a trade with Arizona centered on Francisco for Parra
The question is, can Gearrin get out lefthanded batters in the majors? He’s a sidearm rightie, and they often have problems with lefties.
He would be a right handed specialist. If you need a lefty out in a critical situation you go with Venters or OFlaherty. Martinez, Teheran, and Medlen or Delgado could work middle innings/long relief.
He would be a right handed specialists. If we have a critical matchup against a lefty we could use Veneters, Oflaherty or Medlen.
Every time he’s been brought up, he’s dominated for a bit, then been involved in some blow-up inning where he gave up a mammoth bomb to some lefthanded hitter. Honestly I think it’s a situation of misuse rather than lack of ability.
Damn. I just read that the Yankees say they won’t trade for an A-Roid replacement, but instead they will use Eric Chavez. Well, there goes my Juan Francisco for Andruw Jones idea.
Once Swisher is back they would most likely move Ibanez because Andruw is the RH bat to counter Ibanez or Ichiro.
Ibanez would be better than Hinske at this point.
Franklin,
If this is the appropriate space to express my thoughts, I think a post on which prospects are worth dealing for potentially available starters would be interesting. I don’t think anyone expects you guys to break news on what happens, but we trust your opinions on what is and is not a good deal.
I have a couple of thoughts:
1). Given Teheran’s lack of success in AAA this season, and his complete lack of ability in his major league appearances, I think it’s time for us to consider that he may not be a future top of the rotation starter. I would also like to suggest that Delgado has frequently impressed me, especially with his devastating change-up. I’m no scout, but I may be willing to subscribe to the idea that Delgado will be a superior pitcher to Teheran.
2). That Dempster trade was awful. Nowhere in Dempster’s career is the track record to suggest that he sustains his current stats. If you even partially agree with point #1, then I think a rental deal to get Dempster for Delgado is ridiculous.
3). If we assume that Dempster is among the “2nd tier” of available starting pitchers, what will be the cost of acquiring a 1st tier pitcher? Are we willing to deal both Teheran and Delgado? Do we even have prospects who could replace one of them such that a deal for one of these pitchers is possible? I think the answer to these questions is no, and so I think our hopes of acquiring greinke, shields, garza, are limited.
4). Typically, the market for relief pitchers requires a significantly smaller investment prospect-wise. Why not go after some top relievers and move medlen to the rotation? Medlen is honestly wasted in the bullpen, and I would honestly expect him to at least replicate Dempster’s statistics for the remainder of the season. Why not deal for Broxton, etc.?
5). Heard some Joe Simpson antagonism earlier. He’s not the brightest guy, but if you listen, you hear that he to some extent accepts sabremetrics (without full understanding of any of those states) and he seems like an overall cool guy, definitely one of my favorite announcers.
4).
Joe’s great, man. He’s like watching the game with your cool uncle. Don Sutton is like watching the game with your completely drunk-as-fuck uncle. Chip is like watching the game with your know-it-all college buddy who’s always factually inaccurate, and Jim Powell is the absolute best in the business. He’s the uncle who gives you cash on your birthday and drives a BMW.
I agree with the statement above…I’m starting to lose faith in the Tehran camp…but I’m not all the way yet…
I’m sure they know better than us….they watch him pitch every day…